47%ers and Mitt

faethor

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Somehow I must be confused. Republicans have been selling us for years that paying taxes is bad(tm). That everyone's taxes need to be cut. Bush and Obama cut taxes and about 1/2 the people end up not paying Federal Taxes. Isn't this that partially doing the good work Republicans have been preaching? But, the Republicans chasitie them.
 

cecilia

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as you know, this isn't about taxes, it's about demonizing the poor and middle class.

after all, THOSE people are poor because they are not good at being thieves and stealing their money like the rich are.
 

Fade

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Faethor, I have been buying supplemental health insurance from Humana since I retired, and now they have made me an offer. I have been thinking about those 47%ers and I think I might join them if Obama is reelected. I have always thought it my civic duty to pay for my own supplemental insurance since I can afford to do so, but Humana says that I can let the govt. pay it if I want to.

So I'll let you and Cecilia judge for me. It's a few dollars shy of two hundred dollars a month for me and the wife to be covered, and it would be like a monthly gift from you and Cecilia to me and the wife.

You and Cecilia can work out the details on how much each one of you pays, but between you and me, I don't think Cecilia has a real job, so you might have to take up her slack.

Thanks a million.
Fade
 

robert l. bentham

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Alabama receives almost $4000 per capita in federal spending while contributing about $1000 per capita in federal taxes...
 

cecilia

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It is true that 46 percent of American households did not pay federal income taxes last year, according to the Tax Policy Center. But that number is unusually high, in part because of the recession -- and a majority of that 46 percent still paid payroll taxes. Only 18 percent of American households paid no income taxes and no payroll taxes last year. It is largely low-income seniors and very poor people that legally don't pay federal income taxes or payroll taxes, according to the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities and the Tax Policy Center.

It was also inaccurate for Romney to claim that those who don't pay federal income taxes would vote for President Obama "no matter what." Nearly all states with a high percentage of Americans that don't pay federal income taxes vote Republican in presidential elections, according to the Washington Post.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/18/fact-check-mitt-romney-47-percent_n_1893537.html
 

FluffyMcDeath

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Faethor, I have been buying supplemental health insurance from Humana since I retired, and now they have made me an offer.
What? You have insurance? I thought you were one of those independent minded types who thought that people should pay for their own health care!! Now it turns out you are one of those pinkos who thinks it's OK to pay for other people's health care when you aren't sick and to have other people pay for you when you are!

Thanks a million.
Civic minded people say "You're welcome", even if you are the type who would never return the favour. There will always be freeloaders who don't want to put in their share but it's a price of civilization that civilized people are willing to bear.
 

Glaucus

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What? You have insurance? I thought you were one of those independent minded types who thought that people should pay for their own health care!! Now it turns out you are one of those pinkos who thinks it's OK to pay for other people's health care when you aren't sick and to have other people pay for you when you are!
That's a good point Fluffy. Either private insurance or public insurance it's the same thing - both are schemes that basically make a bet that most people will be healthy most of the time. In both cases people pay into a large fund and withdraw from the fund only when they're sick. The overall principle is exactly the same.

The interesting thing about this scheme is that it is more effective with larger groups, which is why these schemes don't exist on the micro level - we don't see medical spending funds comprised of two or three or even ten people. Only the very wealthy would ever choose to not have some level of insurance and only the very poor can't afford it, and everyone else who chooses not to is just stupid because everyone gets sick and getting sick is outrageously costly.

So anyway you look at it insurance either privately or publicly run is a socialism in action because it is people relying on society to help minimizing their own costs. Socialism is more than just a form of government, it is really just people working together with each other to make things better for everyone. Making health insurance public or private doesn't really change that, except that running a bunch of private insurance companies has a lot of wasted overhead and misses out on the benefits of having a larger group contributing to the shared fund.

Oh, and to get back on topic; Romney is a tool.
 

cecilia

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We Built That: Small Business Abandons Romney and Supports Obama, 47%-39%


Small business owners listed self-employment taxes, the cost of gas, healthcare costs, and personal income taxes to be the biggest burdens. President Obama has cut taxes for small businesses anywhere from 16 to 18 times depending on how a small business tax cut is defined. In contrast Mitt Romney came up with a slogan, but the benefits of his tax plan are designed for corporations and people at the top. Romney’s plan would give the biggest corporations a $1 trillion tax cut.
 

robert l. bentham

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romney-army-brat.jpg
 

Fade

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Fluffy retorted:
"What? You have insurance? I thought you were one of those independent minded types who thought that people should pay for their own health care!! Now it turns out you are one of those pinkos who thinks it's OK to pay for other people's health care when you aren't sick and to have other people pay for you when you are!"
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Fluffy, I knew that Cecilia walks around with her head in a fog, but now I see that you don't have a clue about what happens to US citizens when they reach 65 years old either. At the time, neither did I.

As apparently I am the only person on this board that has reached retirement age, and as I am apparently the only one that knows from experience how the system operates, here is your lesson on retirement and health insurance.
Listen up Cecilia, Feathor, RLB, and any other Fluffy quasi-socialist toadies living in the US, because this is in your future.

I actually retired at age 60, when my main client was bought out by Wells Fargo bank. I continued to buy my health insurance from Blue Cross until 6 months before I reached 65 years old. That was when Blue Cross informed me that upon reaching age 65, and eligible for Medicare, they would no longer sell me standard health insurance.

What a surprise; a company telling me they would no longer sell me their product! They did tell me they would sell me supplemental health insurance after I signed up for Medicare. So off I go to the Social Security office to find out what the (bleep) was going on. Here is what I learned at the Social Security office.

1. Upon reaching age 65 no company would sell me standard health insurance, because upon reaching age 65 I was eligible for Medicare.
2. Upon reaching age 65 I was also eligible for Social Security retirement.
3. In order to sign up for Medicare I had to first sign up for Social Security retirement, although I could delay collecting any money from Social Security retirement until age 72 if I chose.

So if you want full health insurance coverage after age 65, you have to first sign up for retirement, then sign up for Medicare, then buy a supplemental policy that covers the things that Medicare doesn't cover. You could opt out of all the above and pay cash, but then ObamaCare kicks in, and you are hit with his additional penalty for not having insurance.

Welcome to the real world of health insurance at age 65.

Fluffy, if you ever do find a clue, put it in a lockbox, so you can refer back to it when you run out of bullshit.
 

FluffyMcDeath

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Fluffy, I knew that Cecilia walks around with her head in a fog, but now I see that you don't have a clue about what happens to US citizens when they reach 65 years old either. At the time, neither did I.
Nice of you to write a long post in which you miss the point. IF YOU HAVE INSURANCE YOU ARE PAYING FOR OTHER PEOPLE'S HEALTH CARE IF YOU ARE NOT SICK AND IF YOU ARE SICK THEN OTHER PEOPLE ARE PAYING FOR YOU. You are not paying for your own health care, you are spreading the risk with a group of people. You may pay in your entire life, get killed by a falling tree branch or some such and never see a penny of payout. That is socialist. If you were against such things then you should just keep your money and take your chances, pay for healthcare out of your own pocket when you need it.

Difference between private health insurance and public health insurance is that it is way cheaper when the government does it.

That was when Blue Cross informed me that upon reaching age 65, and eligible for Medicare, they would no longer sell me standard health insurance.

Why wont Blue Cross insure you after 65? Because they aren't stupid and they don't want to lose money. The older you get the more likely they will have to pay out to cover health costs and they don't want to. Think the insurance companies don't love the fact that there is medicare to take care of the expensive customers? Come on Fade, you're retired, you have time to think a little before you post, don't you?
 

robert l. bentham

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As apparently I am the only person on this board that has reached retirement age, and as I am apparently the only one that knows from experience how the system operates, here is your lesson on retirement and health insurance.
Listen up Cecilia, Feathor, RLB, and any other Fluffy quasi-socialist toadies living in the US, because this is in your future.


while i admit to being quasi-socialist... i enjoy fire dept, police, military protection... etc... i am a combat veteran... my insurance isn't changing unless i want it to... or an act of congress (they now want a copay on stuff, but i still have original contract with promises spelled out and when they ask, i point to paper and show them where it says FREE, they have sent me no more bills since then, that was ten years ago)... i have gone to the VA for health care for past 18 yrs, i go there now, and i will die in a VA when that time comes. as for being a fluffy toadie, well, red says im a racist child killer, so...sure why not... im a fluffy, racist, toadie, child killer....
 
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